Improving Logistics Ships

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let logistics ships automatically get on km's of people they're repping that manage to get final blows; fixed logistics.
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You're an idiot. Game mechanics have nothing to do with KMs.
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Why would we want to emulate any other MMO in EVE? No thanks to space clerics casting buffs.
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I feel like i just read a guide on how to bring WoW raid healing mechanics to eve
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and you're even more dumb. the only thing that's broken about logi ships as they are now is that they don't get on km's. nothing else that's wrong about them.
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Wait, what?
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These are possibly some of the worst ideas I've read in a long time, it's like I'm back in Features and Ideas.Something that shows is the author's lack of experience with logistics, shown in this line: "So why is it then that repper modules are all the same? Instant activation followed by a cycle time and then a once per cycle increase in shield/armor integrity."Wrong. That's not how they all work. Shield reps are front-loaded: that is, activation, increase in shield integrity, and then the cycle time. And if 'that's not a big deal, doesn't really change how they work', then you shouldn't be writing this article at all.
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Watch out. Incursion Logi Commander giving wisdom for PVP fleets.
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Haha. Oh God this article.Seriously NEVER write on a subject you have no experience on. Please. Your ideas are absolutely terrible.Logistics in Incursion fleets and "1500 hours as Medic in Team Fortress 2" are some of the worst possible qualifications for talking about logistics piloting in EVE. It baffles the mind how this article got published at all.
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It's a better idea than anything proposed in the article, that's for sure.
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eirosI'm sorry, I find most of ideas you put forth rather silly. I say this as someone like you who loves to fly logi my go to ships for pvp are usually the scimi and guardian.While I do agree that reps should repair damage over time I feel that it should be one or the other not choice of “alternate activation”. I like this idea as it provides some leeway, especially for armor RR which lands at the end of the cycle, in the chance that your reps are forced off by ewar midcycle.You cite experiance with Incursions but I have to wonder what sort, if any, experiance you have with triage? While I personally have never flown a carrier in any capacity, triage carriers make up the backbone of my corporations larger scale pvp. The idea of putting a triage module on a Logistics cruiser, while thought provoking, is silly because out side of very specific times you never put a local tank on a basi (or guardian) and local tanks on scimis and onieros are usually only so they can GTFO. After all the tirage module prevents assistance from others. The issue is that if you are in a position to be using triage you'd be better off with a carrier.I do not like any form of mitigation as you descirbed it. My personal thought has always been that if the Logi can't keep up, you might be doing something wrong.I would, however, like to see achorable logistics modules for towers. Combine my very under utilized Starbase Defense skill with my love of logistics.I'm glad to see someone thinking about how to make logistics better. Logi pilots are in high demand because people want to get on all the killmails. I'm all for making logi fun... But I don't want it made easy.
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This right here is the reason it's hard to get logi pilots. They get no +1's on their stat spreadsheets - unless they micromanage drones and forget repping.
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So you have some ideas to add WoW-style healing mechanics to Eve... but you fail to explain why this is necessary in the first place.
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This is undoubtedly one of the worst suggestions I have read, as a matter of fact this suggestion nearly gave me cancer. What you're basically asking for, is to implement these stupid effects and skills from fantasy MMO's such as WoW & Perfect World into Eve Online. First and foremost, whilst Logistics are probably the most in demand ships for fleets nowadays, no amount of shiny fairy sparkles and lightning effects is going to make them more appealing, some people just don't like the Logistics role and will never jump into it. Secondly, as someone already pointed out, allowing Logistics ships to whore on killmails based on the target they are repping is probably one of the most viable long term solutions in order to entice people to atleast try out the role. Being a killmail whore myself, I never really bothered with the Logistics role as I like to blow stuff up and have something to show for it be it a killmail or the guilty pleasure that I made someone go boom. In addition to this, your previous experience with BF2 & whatever the fuck else is meaningless in Eve. The only difference between the medic and assault role in BF2 is that one is able to drop a medkit and the other drops an ammo box, that is not the case with Eve as a Logistics pilot has to fully devote him/herself to repping targets. All in all, this idea is dumb and I still can't decide whether it's a troll.
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Here's an idea, why don't you get a t1 drone, launch it, and assign to your FC.Fuck me. Problem solved, or were you too incompetent to figure that out yourself.
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this has to be a troll, if you want all thoes effects to be in place, go play WOW with the rest of the 12 year olds -.-
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But we do have buffs. They're called Fleet Bonuses. :)
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OMG this is awsome, im surprised you didnt have the idea of having like a logi ship that can like combat res ships once there dead. scrub go play wow ¬.¬
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WoW in space? are blizzard and CCP finally joining forces to make awesome add-ons for each game, OH BOY I CANNOT WAIT.......
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Any chance you could write an article yourself on how to fly and use logi ships in EVE-as-it-is-now?
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Speculation about proposed new features based on other Games is nice, but I was rather hoping for something about how best to use the current features in EVE.Maybe someone could write an article on that?
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Yep, this is what I do. A bay full of bonused logi drones and ONE (1) Whorrior II to assign to an interceptor or whatever. Because my k:dr backbone.
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This article reminded me of an episode of Naruto, in which wannabe-medic Sakura learns that the first thing a medic must learn is how to survive, because a dead medic can't heal anybody.
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I'm sorry but your gearscore is not high enough to be a proper holy guardian...
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Mitigation: There already is the option/role to prevent damage to ships - various forms of EWAR.A Function of Time: The ability to activate a module mid cycle to another target? No.Area of Effect: Lol, no.
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Is there some confusion in EVE between defense and repair?In real-world naval warfare, there is no repair-another-ship-in-combat, but there is a distinction, in air defense, between area defense (Aegis) and point defense (Phalanx, RAM, SeaSparrow).My impression is that EVE may take more inspiration from magical MMO Games than from real-world naval and military science and art. I suppose this is inevitable, though it disappoints me.Of course, what could be more magical than Faster-Than-Light travel?
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As a logi pilot for a sov alliance this, i may just be starting out on logi but my killboard is already turning to crap
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It's a shame that people allow an article to alienate them to such a degree simply because the author listed their background experience in other games and some of the mechanics resound of such foreign implementations. There is an underlying system here that is bland for a # of reasons, as pointed out. It could use some work and this fellow is bandying about ideas to that end. Simply because an element of his idea has appeared in previous games that, as an Eve player, you are strongly pressured to distance yourself from (you know why), doesn't mean the concept has no place in Eve.
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Wow... just wow...These ideas are pretty bad."One of the greatest areas for improvement is the idea that a Logistics vessel should be capable of doing much more than repair – they should be able to prevent that damage from occurring in the first place."Get a command ship, it boosts resistances among other things. Technically they are a branch of logistics as you need logi skill for a fleet command ship ATM.
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Better idea.Remove logistics entirely.More ships explode.Everybody wins.
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Some people just want to watch the world burn...I want to watch the world burn... by antiseptic.
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He did say he is an incursion runner... Incursion runners are the WOW players of eve!
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So this site was designed to be better than EVEnews24?Or was there some sort of merger between the sites that I didn't read about?As bad as any Riverini opinion piece I've ever seen.
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Gotta say, Plato, he's totally off-base. Look at what his ideas are, and not just the fact that people are including 'if you want to use WoW mechanics, use them in WoW' in their replies. You and I've flown together, you know I fly logi - almost exclusively, when a big fleet's called.Buffing in addition to reps? It's a different role - one command ships already fill. If you want a hybrid of that, well, you can do it - it's called a Strategic Cruiser - but it won't do either job as well as the specialist will.AoE repairs? Maybe useful for countering bombers or discoballs, but if you're diluting the repairs in order to spread them across multiple targets, you're just making it easier for the other FC to kill your guys with the second volley - or making it so you need more logi. That's why you broadcast for reps when the enemy fleet yellowboxes, so the reps land before the second shot can go off.Looking at his 'survival - a function of time' section, he's talking about watching the 'health' on 8-9 friendly targets that are being kept locked up - like watching the raid's health meters. He admits to not having Logi experience in EVE, so it's an understandable mistake to make, but... we don't do that. We respond to the FC saying 'get a rep on me' in voice, or fleet members broadcasting for reps, or someone on our watchlist taking hits (and they should be broadcasting, all the same). We don't rep locked targets - we lock targets we need to rep. Just like his AoE repair scenario, he's not accounting for the fact that number one thing that kills ships isn't a constant flow of damage - it's not DPS. It's that single moment of volleyed fire - having half of my repairs land before shot #2 comes in, and half land after... means it's pretty likely the second half don't land at all.Yes, we stagger the reps a little - to try to minimize the 'extra' lost when we hit 100% before the next volley comes in - but we still take big bites of repping when we do, not a constant flow of little nibbles.Logistics is bland? I don't usually find it bland at all. No, it's not a lot of complicated procedures - there's not time in fights w/out TiDi to go through rotation sequences - but when you've got 20 Scimitars trying to counteract the incoming volleys of 80 Naga? It's not exactly dull and boring, either.
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Correction: 'He admits to not having Logi experience in EVE' should have been 'He admits to not having large-scale fleet Logi experience in EVE'. Fingers got ahead of my brain.
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Second Correction: Logi bonuses and Warfare Link bonuses are both Defensive Subsystems, so no, hybridizing a T3 doesn't work. Tired, sorry.
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This is the one and only reason people dont fly logistics more often.
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it would be kinda funny though, seeing shiny paladins being ganked in stormwind and losing their tier4000-equip that they spent 1 year grinding for.
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Moved to F&I
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i dont like them they get no killmails ....wait SAVEMAILS (o0)
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This poster is trying to fix something he's never flown. Which explains his shit flowery "lets make everything into WoW" language. Get the fuck out of EVE and stay there.Logi in EVE has one simple goal, MAXIMUM DPS MITIGATION, because the only damage mechanic we have in EVE other than bombers is PRIMARYING THE TARGET.We have three ways of understanding who's primary: Watchlists, prelocks, and broadcasts. We have literally seconds to figure this out before we start watching people die.Your suggestion that we have longer cycling reps "but for area of effect" is just pants on head retarded in a game where the only mechanic is primarying.Fly a fucking logistics ship in a fleet before going to start making suggestions on how to fix them you fairy fucking sun elf pointy-eared faggot.
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And the rest of EVE online?
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Range issues. If your logistics anchor is half decent, you could be 100km+ from hostiles.
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Jesus Christ, i feel like i just read something from greedy goblin, but for logi pilots.TL;DR version: take wow disc priest abilities and put them into spaceships.i hope you punch yourself in the baby maker for writing this smegma

Reppers, Spacepriests, Force Multipliers. Call them what you will, but Logistics ships are a crucial element to any fleet. From PvP to PvE, Logistics pilots find themselves in demand wherever they go, so why is it that their role is relegated to such an anaemic repertoire of functionality? This will be part 1 of a 2-part series looking at expanding the role of support ships in EVE. In this first piece, I'd like to present, for your consideration and feedback, a list of new functionality for logistics vessels that I feel will benefit the game as a whole, and also expand the role that Logistics pilots can play in game.

However, I would like to put one note before I begin – while I make no claim to be an expert in the field of logistics in EVE Online, my multiplayer curriculum vitae should qualify me to at least speak on the topic. Over 1500 hours as Medic in Team Fortress 2. Max level characters in end-game level content with different healing classes in several popular MMOs, over 500 hours respectively in Support and Medic classes in Battlefield 2 alone, and of course, countless hours as a Basilisk pilot and Logistics Commander in high security space Incursions. This is by no means a comprehensive list, but it should make my point – I like to heal things.

 

LOGISTICS LINEARITY

One thing that often surprises me about EVE's logistics portfolio is just how basic the functionality they provide is. For example, the natural progression of logistics in this game now (post-Retribution) is to enter a logistics frigate, followed by a logistics cruiser, graduating to Tech 2 logistics cruisers, and finally ending with capital ships and their triage modes. Looking at this progression, we see a very linear progression that is at its core: small, medium, large, and capital repair modules; essentially a thought train that goes like this, “the only way I'll be a more effective logistics pilot is by flying the next ship up in size.” This is somewhat desirable as the hull prices speak for themselves, and it does allow small gang PvP to access logistics capability without needing Racial Cruiser V or the possibly prohibitive price tag. But let's explore some new options that may allow us to make logistics, as a role, more exciting, and combat as a whole, more interesting.

For the record, the ideas I propose are not novel; though they may be derivative, I have modified and adapted these ideas for EVE Online's unique combat environment.

 

MORE THAN REPAIRS - MITIGATION

One of the greatest areas for improvement is the idea that a Logistics vessel should be capable of doing much more than repair – they should be able to prevent that damage from occurring in the first place.

It's no secret that in large fleet PvP that known FCs are primaried first to remove them from the battlefield (which has spawned its own meta game in and of itself). Imagine then a logistics vessel being able to grant a ship an extra layer of protection, capable of absorbing a certain amount of damage, before the first strike even touches shields. This could be in the form of a high slot module that activates instantly, lasts a set duration of time (let's say 10-15 seconds), or a set amount of damage, and is followed by a cooldown period of 2-3 minutes preventing its overuse and abuse and the caveat that the target that has received the extra layer of protection may not have that module activated on it, may not receive the benefit again for the same 2-3 minute cooldown period. In this way, we may preserve the ability of combat fleets of still being able to kill whatever it is that their primary is should they be absolutely resolved to do so, but allowing logistics pilots the flexibility of being able to instantly stop damage on a target as they triage their fleet and juggle the broadcasts coming in. A module such as this should take the spot of a repair module with similar power grid and CPU requirements.

 

SURVIVAL - A FUNCTION OF TIME

One thing that any pilot that interact with logistics pilots will tell you is that time is of the essence. After all, they don't call it triage because you can take your sweet time to repair everyone. So why is it then that repper modules are all the same? Instant activation followed by a cycle time and then a once per cycle increase in shield/armor integrity. Can we not provide a solution that gives logistics pilots more flexibility with regards to how those reps are applied?

Consider that all Tech 2 Logistics cruisers have a maximum of 10 locked targets. Glossing over the fact that the Basilisk and Guardian may need to have 1 or 2 of those targets locked just to keep a capacitor transfer chain up to stay cap stable, and we have 8 to 9. But you'll notice that most fits only include about 3 or 4 repair modules per ship. So while it is fortunate that a typical logistics pilot will be able to view the status of 8 or 9 ships at once, their ability to do something about it, is about half that (though repair drones do count for something).

Imagine, then, the proposed idea of being able to activate an “alternate activation” of your typical repair module to switch away from traditional repair to a charge based , instant activation, alternate usage that would provide a target with repairs over time, albeit with more repairs than standard repair modules. The trade off is striking – more repairs, but over time. This means that in combat, a ship can still be burned down, but if left neglected, gains an advantage. In addition, logistics pilots can quickly select a pilot provide a top up repair, or a temporary repair (until more repair modules free up), not having to wait for long cycle times to end (thus providing a more responsive experience for logistics pilots), and all the while being limited to charges that they can fit in a cargo hold. After all – what is the purpose of all that space in your cargo hold anyhow? Charges would need to be a separate item, unlike the Ancillary Shield Boosters, and would need to be large enough so as to restrict their usage, but small enough that they are not hindering logistics ships that may need to carry extra flights of logistics drones or are running out of charges in longer engagements.

 

SPREAD THE WEALTH - AREA OF EFFECT

Area of Effect has been in games since time immemorial, and while one might argue that AoE is not all that applicable in a three-dimensional game such as EVE, I have a few words for you: bubbles, smartbombs, and bombing runs. AoE is a significant part of EVE, and it's high time that it be used for more than just exploding things. For this I have two suggestions: a sub-capital AoE triage module and an anchorable structure that would provide damage mitigation to the ships within its field for a set duration of time and damage.

For the first suggestion, I imagine a triage module that would go into the high power slot of the ship. It would allow the Logistics vessel the ability to gain the current triage module benefit of a large bonus to repair strength. But, it would also allow the closest set number of ships within its radius of effect to be repaired for roughly a half of a standard repair, within the same cycle time as well. The trade-off being a longer cooldown like 5-10 minutes.

The second suggestion is fairly straight forward, a damage mitigation shield for a set radius of effect, for a short duration of time and damage, and instead of taking up a module slot, would be an anchorable (only in 0.0 and WH space) item that would need a short period of time to anchor (during which time it could be destroyed), but with enough HP to survive a sneeze. This would allow for group mitigation of damage, but would not be available to protect against mistakes such as finding yourself in a trap of smartbombing battleships or being slaughtered by a well-executed bombing run, it again, gives more tools to logistics pilots to use for the purpose of keeping more ships alive.

 

LEAVING LOGISTICS - CONCLUSION

In summary, logistics ships are a significant component to combat in EVE. And by expanding their roles as support ships, we have an opportunity to shake things up in the world of combat in EVE, and also provide a more interesting experience to logistics pilots in the game. While everyone loves having a logistics pilot in their fleet, not everyone loves being the logistics pilot. It is my hope that the suggestions I've put forth today will at least start the discussion of expanding their role so as to make them a more attractive and sought after role to play. And while some may say “isn't combat hard enough?” or “why would you want to make it harder for ships (and thus ISK) to get destroyed?”, I would reply that change is the lifeblood of EVE. War never changes, until it does.

Then it gets more interesting.

 

[name_1]
WTHisgoingon, Writer, all around terrible EVE player