Are Slowcats Overpowered?

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Slowcats are far too good at killing subcapitals.It is nice having a drone bay that can hold plenty of fighters, but when that drone bay can hold FOUR THOUSAND sentries, we have a problem. Even T1 sentries in mass are very good. So even if you do bombing run after bombing run; unless someone brings only one or two flights of sentries, you won't be able to defang slowcats.Yes if you are lucky enough to know who the drone anchor is, you can see about dampening or jamming them, but what about when that fleet of slowcats gets a lock on you and manually tells the drones to erase your ship from the overview?Give carriers a fighter only bay and a much, much smaller drone bay (maybe enough for 40-50 sentries) and now start to open up the possibility to defang these monsters.Sadly the only real counter at the moment is dreads, but when that slowcat fleet is closely guarded by daddy super capital fleet, yeah... have fun with that.
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HILMAR_KELLER is a clueless baddie o7
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To actually get capital killed in EVE, they must be used and be considered more than just a big shiny toy you use once a year for dat big fight.
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So a supported slowcat fleet is invincible. Awesome. Escalating a slowcat fleet in a wormhole is impossilbe...awesome....
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If my understanding is correct, sentry carriers, like Foxcats, have enough buffer to be impossible to volley, and enough fleet reps to make shooting at them futile once reps land. The rock paper scissors comparison breaks down when you have dread scissors, slowcat paper, and supercapital rock, but the only counter to rock is to bring more rocks. And once it's assured you have more rocks than your oppoments, you can send out as many slowcats as you want, knowing that any dread drop will result in a lot more dead dreads than slowcats.The real life comparison would be sending bombers (slowcats) to gleefully bomb the hell out of your hapless enemy after having established air (Supercapital) superiority.
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The only people that complain about slowcats being "too powerful" or "broken" are scrubs who don't know how to kill them or aren't willing to risk things in order to do so.
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"bawwww i don't want to use my brain to think and i don't wanna risk my caps to kill other caps PLS CCP NERF CARRIER BUFF da bl0b PLS PLS pls"
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OH MY GOD MY CRUISER GANG CAN'T KILL A CAP FLEET.OP is right, slowcats are not an instant win button. We need more caps dying not less; carriers and dreads should be better than battleships.
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>implying most people bring thousands of sentriespeople tend to pack in a hundred or so of each type, provided you don't accidentally bump away from them, you can get by on like 50 no problem, so your "nerf" doesn't even fix the nonexistent issue it's trying to fix
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A few counters to the original post:-The ability of the carrier to refit instantly to anything at any time is what makes them overpowered. Sentries are bad at tracking, and the damage is not bonused... But carriers can effectively have 3 drone damage mods, 3 drone tracking mods, AND a full tank by virtue of refitting! Additionally, they deploy 9+ sentries, instead of 5. A "painful bombing run" need not be painful; a recall drones hotkey can pull them back into bay within a second, saving them from harm.-Highly variable tank due to refitting allows the selection of optimal resistances in real time. Furthermore, because of refitting, it is possible to overheat-The subcap that can be "damped or jammed to uselessness" in fact cannot, because the carriers have the ability to remote boost and eccm their FC.- The FC, invulnerable to ewar via carrier support (cap xfer too), has the ability to web and paint their targets.This fleet is overpowered. Yes hostiles can drop dreads, but unless this is amazingly timed with an onlining cynojammer, supers are coming in next. And only 2-3 entities can escalate that high, and whichever side PL chooses will win 90% of the time.The only thing that could "kindve" work is 2 full alphafleets OR a sizeable damping/ewar fleet+ high dps fleet. None of these tactics "have yet been seen" just as with titans.
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your understanding isn't correct because you shouldn't be able to volley through caps without having serious numerical superiority, numpnuts
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have you ever bumped in a capital shipit happens all the time, you end up abandoning sentries more than recalling them
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Still more bitching.
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I have seen so many carrier kills by subcaps. Look at Verge of Collapse (Volta/Aquilla).
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I think the main counter to the slowcat fleet has been missed here, if you take Typhoon fleet issue gang of about 60 with 15 guardians and a few support, 5 of those typhoons can have a full rack of large smartbombs, your other typhoons can fit torps of 900dps easy as well as mounting 2-3 heavy neuts on the top rack, neut primary shoot primary 5 of those logi should be cap only setup so you can give cap to the SBers. By doing this your SBs will kill off all sentries in range every few seconds your able to perma run this thanks to the cap guardians, also with the neuts you can turn off the primary's active hardeners and hit them hard. Typhoons get a spare mid or 2 so they can fit a damp just to mess people up more. OFC if theres a 300 man drake fleet then you may need a loki fleet as support to kill the drakes off or just ward them off from your typhoons, keep em bubbled and they aint moving
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>Sadly the only real counter at the moment is dreads, but when that slowcat fleet is closely guarded by daddy super capital fleet, yeah... have fun with that.You mean a heavily tanked capital fleet might only be vulnerable to other capitals and supers? Say it aint so!Or in the words of Testbro, "OH MY GOD MY CRUISER GANG CAN'T KILL A CAP FLEET."
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You are forgetting shit alpha which is the reason we have Capital escalation to begin with. 50 Maels to alpha a Fox, 300 Maels to alpha a Slow. Are 300-man fleets rare at the fleet level?
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Why do all of you scrublords bitching about boots/slow cats. If carrier blob shows up on field, drop it with supers and titans as intended. If your FCs and alliance are to much of a pussy to deploy shiny supers to counter boots/slow cats then go suck shit through a straw.
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So I said that they have a lot of buffer, and you said caps should have a lot of buffer, how is my understanding not correct? Never stated that caps shouldn't have a lot of buffer against subcaps.
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Well, 300 man fleets aren't rare, but 300 maels means probably another 200 in support ships. So what you need, is 500 people, 300 of them sitting in 350 mil isk subcaps to alpha-attrition a slowcat, which only costs 2-2.5 bil on a reasonable fit.
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Ontop of that phoons do go quite fast and with an MWD can easily bump a fleet of carriers so some start getting out of rep range
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THIS THIS DOWN IMMEDIATELYsomeone might grow a brain and start to counter it.
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Are you by any chance related to progodlegend?
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In a fleet of 100 Slowcats, each well placed bomb is going to destroy 800 sentry drones - roughly half the cost of a carrier.Shouldn't take too many bombing runs to defang these guys.
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I would agree with the idea of a Fighter Bay and a separate drone bay on carriers.
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Why not just a group of 10 - 15 bombers on constant runs ? They either keep their drones in or lose them. Seems like that effectively de-fangs the entire fleet.
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Without the slowcats on field, the lokis should be considered op and in need of a nerf.
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A) Maels don't need support against capitals. They may have, but they don't need it for a theoretical comparison to stationary Capital sigs.B) You nere 300 to alpha a 3m hp ship, not to fight them. You misunderstand the comparison.C) The same misunderstanding go here: you don't need 300 Maels to kill a single carrier, you will begin to have alpha potential when you do. Context is important if you wish to make or understand comparison. You don't have context so you don't understand slows or ship balance in general.Concepts like these are powerful because of blobs, not the other Way around. Nerf them and you buff the bottom-out blob that is the problem in the first Place. Line-up, Tech One, subcap, blob-play is the scourge of EVE, things like Slows are counter-symptoms. Other People have already given you a handful of counters to Slows, i just reminded you of the reason they exist.But if you want to buff the HBC and CFC further...
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This right here ^
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nope that's just my opinion on the best way to counter sentry using carriers
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nerf lokis, nerf 720's
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If you are fielding slowcats in a WH, it is either your home WH, or you did a damn good job bringing them in through entrances, and you could have easily done the same thing with dreads. Dunno about you, but I would be more afraid of a dread fleet than a slowcat fleet in a WH.
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subcaps havent been used as drone assigns for slowcats since the very first ever slowcat fight. If you use a non capital as an assign you are wrong.
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Also, if Maels actually did cost 350-400m you would have made a point, bit insurance still exist yeah? A Good suggestion to need Slows would then be to nerf insurance so you nerf the need to escalate into raw-buffer concepts like Slows.Once again, Slows are popular because little else can deal with a 100+ blob shitfest of Trading blows. Supers are the next raw-buffer escalation in the way of making cheap-blobbing reign supreme.
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You didn't justify why your first point means they're overpowered. You only described the entire point of that feature of carriers.Of fucking course the side that can escalate better will win. This is eve online, it's not about honourable balanced duels. If you think this is a problem you really don't get this game.
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With what ship would you do the bumping? Please choose a mach or vagabond, those will not be instantly destroyed.As for the smartbombing phoons; when battleships get deployed, dreads will show up on cynos 30km away from the carrier fleet. A group fielding carriers would like nothing more than an escalation to Battleships.
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If you drop supers and titans then what do you do when the other side drops more supers and titans? It's not like reinforcements are difficult to call.
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Another point of eve online is that larger numbers of smaller things can threaten "greater" ships. My point is that because of supreme carrier flexibility, this is no longer true of carriers. A hawkfleet can kill caracals and battleships. A subcap fleet needs either 400+ damage/high alpha members to alpha a single carrier, or the tandem of 50 ewar cruisers with a rather large dps squadron. I feel it is imbalanced.
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Good read.I think there's a bit of an imbalance on how many Sentries a Carrier can carry as well as the ability to assist a single person in a fleet to cause pretty much instant damage. The rate of fire on sentries being every 4 seconds is also pretty nuts when you're talking hundreds of them and utilizing this mechanic in such a manner can be very strong.Do I think it's over powered? No... Not at all. But I think there's some slight re-balancing that could be done to cut them down just a little. I think it's great that carriers have a valid use in combat and are being fielded regularly. I also like that there's a lot of discussion on counters with this setup. People are starting to use their brains again rather than IWIN buttons and it's made combat in EVE interesting.I think that the capacity on the drone bay could use a review to address how many flights of sentries a carrier can carry. One thing I mentioned when they removed the drone bays on supers was that they should make a drone bay and a fighter bay instead of removing drones all together. However, now with how carriers are being used, I'd imagine we'd see slow... lions? The other thing is the rate of fire on sentries could use a slight increase, maybe instead of a 4 second ROF, maybe 5-6 seconds, this or maybe a scan res penalty on the person they're assisting. The last issue with them is the ability to assign, literally, thousands to a single character and have them all hit a target at once removes on of the things that makes larger ships balanced without sensor boosters and that's the scan resolution. Part of a drawback for using any large ship in the game is that if you want to lock a target fast, you need to sacrifice tank or utility to achieve this.As I said already, I don't think they're over powered as there are counters to them, but they could use a review on their capabilities and the mechanics used to implement them effectively. It's a strong fleet doctrine, but not too strong.
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People advocating bombing slowcats are all and well, except the fact that BOMBS DON'T WORK IN LOWSEC.
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Yes exactly, finally someone who gets it! Now, consider that Slows are used for the same reason in the first Place: overwhelming subcap numbers with little to no subcap counters.
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Richter isn't a capital FC and hasn't FCd in more than a month because of computer issues you mongoloid.
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This won't work. Black Legion already tried using 5+ firewall ships with a full rack of smartbombs to kill sentries. We just refitted to have a heavy neut or two and neuted them all out, as would happen here. Neuting a slowcat fleet is completely ineffectual as well, given that part of the doctrine is capchaining. You can neut the primary all you want but that's not going to do shit when he's getting cap from the other 30 archons in the fleet.
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Slowcats refit two one neut a piece in their high slot and a web in mids, no more smart bombing typhoon, typhoon's large sig size then easily alphad by sentries
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It takes more than one bomb to kill a sentry drone, the drones are spread out over more than a single bomb's radius and can usually be recalled if they are still in range, the slowcats can bubble themselves to remove the ability of bombers to escape after bombing and remove their ability to quickly bomb, the slowcats carry more than 10 flights of every sentry
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-A- attempted this tactic with sniping tornadoes during the Delve war. It did not work.
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The firewall ships died because they were at 0 on the slowcat blob trying to kill drones, which just resulted in all of them being webbed, neuted to 0 cap, painted, and blapped.
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Bahahahahahaha, come back when you are more informed.
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But we aren't *demanding* this. In fact, we quite enjoy being able to massacre your sub caps when outnumbered. Sure it'd be nice if there was a nerf to the slowcats, as yes that is our main problem at the moment, but until then we have other fleets and ideas in the works.
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The only effective counter to slowcats is a complete numerical support fleet superiority, supercapitals, dreadnaughts, or 10-20 smart bombing battleships to continuously sacrifice themselves to drain the drone bays. Once drones are killed, it can take a while before you can relaunch and reassign them due to the buggy way assigning drones currently registers. Small sig-tanking ships are reasonably effective in avoiding sentry damage. During most of the fights with Black Legion Lokis, HBC sentry drones spent most of the fight being unable to hit anything besides dudes being bad. The lack of mobility that slowcats have results in the sentries being easily outranged with little recompense besides moving the slowcat fleet (very risky, almost always results in one or two carriers that didn't align being left behind and thus very vulnerable to death). If the opposing FC leaves the field and seeks to battle elsewhere in system, you remove the Slowcats from the equation for a good chunk of time as they organize an attempt to move. There are many viable strategies that hugely reduce the effectiveness of the slowcat, should the FC on the opposing side actually make use of them.However, some of the assertions in this article are pretty bad. Ewar is not going to work when you can get the drone assign carrier up to 500+ sig strength and 500+ sig res with remote and local ECCM/RSebo. Organized normal bombing of drones becomes impractical with the addition of a single anchored bubble which can also be kept alive by the slowcats.AHACs are an absolutely terrible way to kill slowcats. While they may avoid most of the sentry damage, slowly they will be neuted out one by one and killed when they lose their AB or they are forced to use long range Scorch ammo. Against a Zealot using Scorch, an all 5s Archon with EM/Therm hardeners has a 5.3k+ DPS tank with a SINGLE Capital remote rep on them. With two slowcats repping another Archon primaried by Ahacs (two reps per slowcat), that's a 21.5k+ DPS tank. A typical AHAC Zealot with Scorch does about 400 DPS. It would take ~53 Zealots to break a Slowcat Archon with two other Slowcats repping it. Considering most Slowcats fleets contain 30+ carriers, good luck breaking any slowcat with AHACs."a Slowcat that hits Triage to save itself has become a liability, as it can neither use drones nor receive remote reps."Slowcats never fit Triage mods. They aren't a slowcat if they have one on.In conclusion, Slowcats are a very powerful doctrine but they are not invincible by any stretch of the imagination. Several of their counters are guarded against by the supercapital superiority of the alliances that typically utilize them. However, there are many mitigating strategies that remove a huge chunk of the actual killing effectiveness of the doctrine that are simple and easy to implement. A fleet of more than 30+ carriers should be a powerful force when used correctly and shouldn't be able to be destroyed by some random cruiser fleet with massive support number inferiority. One of the issues that makes slowcats seem more powerful than they actually are is the fact that the alliance using them almost always has a massive numerical superiority with support that would probably be able to eliminate the enemy on their own. Slowcats are a supplementary doctrine, not a mainline one.There should be some use of capital ships besides shooting and repping structures, which many seem to be clamoring for as the only real purpose that carriers and the others should actually have.Keep slowcats the way they are. Actually use the mitigating tactics that limit them instead of being a bunch of bads and flinging yourselves at a sentry blob over and over and expecting a different result.
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bahahaha ive been on every HBC capital fleet for the last 6 months. Ricther doesn't drop slowcats, because richter doesn't and has never FCd capitals. Richter hasn't even been online for the Black Legion deployment until like a week ago, so I'm not sure why you think he is the one dropping slowcats. Richter is not even a member of the HBC capitals group.It is you who is uninformed. If slowcats get dropped, it is by actual capital FCs.
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drop supers AND dreads, you pussy
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Part of the issue here is " Magic " cap trans. By some mystical means no one can explain you can consume 100 cap and beam it to someone else where on arrival it becomes 130 or more. Because of this and the depth of a carriers tank they become almost impossible to kill in a practicle sense. Local and remote reps have a near limitless supply of cap to rep with. Just one of many issues long overdue for rebalacing.
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I don't think 7 dead out of 25 constitutes their fleet being "overwhelm[ed]"
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Has anyone ever considered Micro-Jump-Drive Tempest fleets?Just a thought but wouldn't that mean the bubble is absolutely useless as well as hindering your own escape?Heavy neuts on the tempests would be able to disrupt the cap chain plenty and not to mention you could bring a few smart bombers in for the inevitable sentry/heavy/medium drone blob from the carriers.
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You can call someone any name in the book, but if you add "Is" and "or aren't they?" at the beginning and end, you haven't insulted them, you've just asked a question. It's kinda like what the title of this article does. It is a bit ironic to see Goon propaganda using suggestion in such a Glenn Beck-type way. I thought they hated Glenn Beck.
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EWar is an effective counter to boots.Jamming is effective at breaking reps (both by breaking cap chains and by jamming directly)Boots can be alpha'd by subcaps.Boots can be DPSd before armor reps land.Rifters can prevent escape.Dictors can prevent escape by the whole force.They can't move without recalling sentries. Bombs can kill their dps.Void bombs can break cap chains and prevent reps.Dreads can/will/do kill boots.Boots/slowcats are powerful, but not the win button titans used to be.
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In point of fact, CFC does not count. What's the strength of a cap fleet? Ability to refit on the fly. The idea that a slowcat counterdrop will make mincemeat out of them assumes they will just sit there like sheep and get slaughtered. This is absurd, again, CFC excepted. No, they will refit, and hold the field until supers and counter-drops arrive.
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This is unpopular, but basically right. These guys brought caps. They happen to be sub-cap killers, but fact remains they are caps. To fight them you must bring your own caps and supers. They're a show of force that you can escalate on, which is of course what they are hoping for 99% of the time.
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And? How many bombing runs do you think you'll be able to do before they just bubble themselves? You might even win the ISK war if they don't care, but you'll lose the objective because slowcats can carry several flights of sentries.
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So what you're saying is that BL shouldn't win? This sounds stupid, but a 1000 man alliance vs a 13000 man alliance (not even counting the rest of the HBC)... Well, yea, they're gonna get blobbed.
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The problem with this is capitals need more versatility than subcaps, they are balanced around that. What should happen is to remove in combat fitting together with adding more fitting slots above 8 and rebalancing all the capitals from scratch around the new number of fitting slots.This would allow pilots to fit for a limited amount of versatility without letting them refit to exactly counter whatever is fielded against them.
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I wanted to write some sort of proper reply to this article, but then I realized it's made by one of Kugu's retards.So meh, just use your brain scrublord and stop whining for somebody being better then you.
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I never said it was Test slow cats you retard. Obviously you were not in Huna the other day.
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Lol well therein lies the problem - what is the true purpose of carriers? I believe they are supposed to be capital sized logistics - not subcap killers. When titans could kill subcaps they got nerfed hard, heck even tracking dreads got nerfed a bit. If carriers are intended to be subcap killers then so be it, but i think the problem here is that they aren't.
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jesus christ this bugs out hard for me sometimes (((
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This is not just about slowcats, its about the blob that comes with them and yea... i'm part of a blob so not bitching, just making a point. Slowcats in a reasonably sized alliance would easily be counter able but for example Solar and Fazor had about 240 in an afternoon fleet on the way to take on about 200/210 N3 and co... jump in, start to fight... cyno up and enter 61 PL Slowcats, fight over. This would have been a good fight, and not the first time we have had to deal with it. My point is its also the amount people can field based on the super blobs out there now and the almost impossible numbers of supers they can counter drop you with should you escalate that way.
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there were test and raiden slowcats clearly you didn't have your eyes open
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Any ship with utility highs could fit smartbombs and always promptly kill any DPS from the Slowcats, you will however be in neut range and possibly fighting other enemy fleets...
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I hear only mimimimimi!
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After reading this article, I don't think they are asking for help :)
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what you mean every time someone assists the 'assister' they lose lock on their target?
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"The main advantage that Slowcats exploit is the drone assignment mechanics." EXPLOIT, thats a funny choice of word Hilmar. If you start jamming or sensor damping the t3 targeting ship carriers simply refit remote eccm etc etc. Put enough ecm on field carriers refit eccm. Two fixes to this mechanic, stop agreesed carriers from refitting and remove drone assigning altogether from the game. It may not be brokern but its certainly not balanced.
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Yes, let's nerf caps and supers so the only thing that matters is who drops more fully insured BS, or who resupply most fully insured BS the quickest. GG.Nerf cost-effect of Tech 1 subcaps first, then worry about symptoms.Meaningless explosions is what lead to a blobby and pointless game.
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No, it should be that the carrier have to lock up their person they want to assign their drones too. With figthers it shouldnt be needed since they got pilots them self( according to lore).
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Bombers, to make your enemy think 2x about deploying drones...Sniper Nagas or Sniper Nados to exploit carrier mobility & the semi limited range of sentries.Other Caps to out right brawl. I wouldn't Expect 200 cruisers to out brawl 100 remote rep domis, why expect drakes to be a viable answer to anything you fight?
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BL held the field and took the objective, "slowcats" were forced to withdraw. You don't stick around and lose them all when "overwhelmed".
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You may not be, but people who are complaining about sentry carriers are.
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Show me an example. Wait your example is invalid. Cause I said so.
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Why are you fighting in lowsec?
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tl;dr BL is bitching about trying to take on 400 man HBC subcap fleet and 50+ man slowcat fleets with 75 guys. Ofc you're going to lose...
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This right here. Just bump the carriers 50+km from each other. Sure your transversal will be low, but if you're quick enough it will work. And void bombs are under-used. Once you bump a carrier off, a quick wave of 40 void bombers will quickly neut out the carrier.

I was drawn into a lively debate about spider-tanking sentry Carriers, also known as Slowcats.  The context: Last week, Black Legion brought about 150 armor Lokis plus support to a timer in Delve.  TEST responded with Drakes, which died en masse to focused medium artillery volleys, and Slowcats, which didn't die at all.  Thanks in part to reshipping but mostly due to the dependable alpha from sentry drones, TEST held the field and drove Black Legion away with about 50 Loki losses, while TEST lost around 300 Drakes and support

I have no problem accepting that the tipping factor in this fight was the TEST Slowcat fleet.  But people are beginning to question whether the Slowcat is another iteration on the rock-paper-scissors game or another trump card much like Tracking Titans were before a series of nerfs rendered their previously held strengths moot.

Tracking Titans: Death By Spacedongs

Not long ago, Titans were the absolute endgame for fleet combat.  A wave of Titans could decimate any subcapital force regardless of size or composition.  Some argued that subcapitals could counter a Titan fleet - assuming enough subcapitals and few enough Titans - but it was never seen.  To this day, the only thing that has ever countered a Titan fleet has been another, larger supercapital fleet.

The reasons for Titan superiority were diverse.  First and foremost, the Doomsday was a subject of much loathing, capable of taking out any target on the field within range except for another Super or a well-tanked Carrier.  This meant logistics, command ships, hictors and dictors could be selectively removed from the battlefield regardless of tank, size or speed.  A subcapital fleet with twenty logi versus twenty Titans had twenty less logi in the second minute of the fight than they did in the first due to selective Doomsdaying. 

Second was the ability of Titans to track and kill with guns.  Aided by Huginn webs and target painters, Tracking Titans made quick work of any fleet idealistic enough to stand in the way.  PL FCs often bragged that they stopped calling primaries as one Titan could two-volley an Abaddon off the field.  Smaller, faster targets could be painted and webbed down, while the most obnoxious targets to kill could be selectively Doomsdayed without consequence. 

Third was the defensive potential of each Titan.  With enormous EHP and inability to be affected by any Ewar except for Hictors/Dictors, many options that are normally available in subcap vs. subcap fights simply aren't on the table against Titans.  It's certainly not possible to field enough subcaps to volley a Titan, nor to jam them out, tracking disrupt them, make them softer targets, or selectively dismantle a Titan fleet by taking out crucial elements.  The only true counter to a Titan fleet was a larger Titan fleet.

More Slowcats, More Problems

I'm not surprised that some people would like us to remember the days of Tracking Titans when we talk about Slowcats.  They would like to say "The only counter is more of them" or "Their tank is impossible to break with subcaps" or something to that effect.  Neither of these statements are true, however.

The main advantage that Slowcats exploit is the drone assignment mechanics.  Slowcats deploy sentries and then assign them to one fast-locking subcapital, usually a T3 Cruiser which is already receiving remote reps such that it's nearly impossible to volley.  This means that Slowcats don't have to follow or lock up primary targets - their only responsibilities are in repping each other and replacing sentries if they are destroyed.  But the FC subcapital, if identified, can be jammed or sensor damped into being unable to give the sentry drones a valid target.

Plus, many forget that Carriers do not get a bonus to drones.  They receive a significant bonus to Fighters, but not to combat or sentry drones.  Sentries themselves do not have phenomenal tracking or optimal+falloff - at under 15km, they have trouble hitting anything smaller than a BC.  And since Slowcats are entirely dependent upon these drones for DPS, removing the sentries from the field via Stealth Bombers is easy.  Of course, they can easily be re-deployed, but it does provide a short break during which the carrier pilot has to re-deploy and re-assign drones.  T2 Sentries are also expensive: A successful bombing run against twenty Slowcats will take 200 Sentries off the field for a total loss of 300mil. 

The final weakness of Slowcats is that they can be hit with Ewar.  The spider tank on something with as much buffer and capacitor as a Slowcat is excellent, but focused jams can neutralize remote repairs and sensor damps make them very slow to lock, which buys ample time to reduce a primary.  And a Slowcat that hits Triage to save itself has become a liability, as it can neither use drones nor receive remote reps.

A Fistful of Counters

Are Slowcats easily killed with a certain kind of subcap, or will they be killed by equal numbers of some subcap?  Almost certainly not, but I wouldn't expect a capital to be matched by a subcapital.  However, if the goal were to kill a fleet of lightly supported Slowcats (note that 300 Drakes is not 'light support'), I would choose AHACs.  Able to sig tank a great deal of drone damage while keeping two mids open for sensor damps, killing a group of Slowcats would come down to beating their reps.  It has also been suggested that sniper platforms with damps applied to the target caller can stay out of harm's way, though they likely don't bring enough DPS to kill any targets.

This hasn't happened yet, of course, because Slowcats are never 'lightly supported.'  The side with the Slowcats always brings more to the field.  It's debatable, for example, whether Black Legion could've held the field in their most recent Loki fight if it weren't for the Slowcats.  But I strongly believe that the Slowcats would have died in a fire without their support fleet.  More importantly, Slowcats without support leave themselves vulnerable to the most obvious counter of all - Dreadnoughts.  Regardless of reps, a small team of Moroses would make quick work of unsupported Slowcats.  The same was said about Titans (that they die without support) but before Crucible, in a hopeless scenario, Titans could still doomsday dictors off the field and jump out, as long that the opposition does not bring more within the next ten minutes.  Meanwhile, a Slowcat can be tackled indefinitely by a Rifter. 

I would not conclude that Slowcats are overpowered, and further, trying to attach them to Tracking Titans is a severe exaggeration of their abilities.  I'm hearing a lot of Slowcat paranoia because they are used by leading powerbloc alliances almost exclusively.  The HBC and CFC can afford to field Slowcats because any escalation by a hostile force would inevitably lead to counter-escalation.  More than anything else, they are a show of force - perhaps not as spectacular as Supercarriers or Tracking Titans used to be, but the next best thing.  But without support, they can be broken just like subcaps.

Thanks to StevieTopSiders for the original thread on Kugutsumen.

The blackest member of Kugutsumen.com.